Dell complaints

[DELL-Jimmy_P]

[Rocke_T_Sinetist]

Nobody said Dell is the only one with that procedure.

General Motors doesn't dismantle and scrap a car that won't start at the end of the assembly line. Donut makers recycle the dough they cut out for the holes, or cook the holes and sell them. Nothing unethical about that.

As I defined a few frames back, refurbished means previously sold and shipped as new, exactly in accordance with law.

The computer industry is, however, the only one which dispatches refurbished parts rather than new ones for warranty repairs. General Motors does NOT do that, nor does Maytag, or Whirlpool, or Panasonic.

Further, 'new' parts can be defective, so it's not like there is a whopping distinction. The distinction within Dell, is that parts are put back into rebuild/repair stock after cursory testing which is inadequate to root out incipient failures and intermittents. That's firsthand data from within Dell. I don't know who else may/may not do that.
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Rocke T Sinetist
as in, 'it doesn't take a...'

[Commendatore]

Rocke_T_Sinetist wrote:

[Rocke_T_Sinetist]

'Fraud and criminal' is an exaggeration. They DO test them. The tests aren't very comprehensive, that's all. All but useless as laboratory tools, except that they exercise the drives and a skilled person can determine whether operation is correct or not.

If he's paying attention, knows what he's doing, and gives a shit, that is. Catch being, Dell no longer employs anyone like that.

That would be a conscientious, knowledgeable American, and Dell complies with W Bush's Leave No American Employed Act.
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Rocke T Sinetist
as in, 'it doesn't take a...'

[FallenAngel]

A buddy of mine and I talked about this very thing just yesterday. He had some electronics crap out and this is a replacement of his original already. Despite this point, we both agreed that in some cases (like with electronics) it is better to receive refurb or "reconditioned" merchandise simply because it has already failed once.

Now you don't have to wonder. Also because in the majority of reputable companies cases, it also means that it has been serviced already and they don't want to see it back in for repair. Key words being reputable companies.

You can buy "new" and expect that you'll see a recall of something or a mass part failure etc, or you can get a refurb that has already been-there-done-that and you have far less to worry about.

All the reconditioned items I own are still working as-is several years later. A lot of the "new" items I purchased along the way have failed.

[Rocke_T_Sinetist]

Depends if you're talking about systems, parts, or exactly what part. A refurb Pentium is no different from a new one. It can't fake its way through the test, and they're impervious to handling as long as it's static-free.

A system might--indeed, has--fake(d) its way through the tests with an intermittent which just didn't happen to be intermittenting when the test was run. So, 2 cursory tests don't tell you any more than 1 does. There's no such thing as free reliability. Yes, new can fail too, and not all refurbs started out as failures. Statistically, I'd call it a wash. Dell reliability is a crapshoot at best.

You do NOT want a refurb harddrive. Those have been handled 4 times as much as new ones, and every handling is an opportunity to damage it. Memory is more rugged, but every time it's plugged in is an opportunity to flex it and break a BGA bond, which will pass tests and fail 2 weeks later when oxide builds up on the discontinuous surfaces.

Dell's optical drive diagnostic is so weak it cannot detect an obviously defective drive, unless as I said the operator knows what he's doing, is paying attention, and gives a shit. Those conditions are damned unlikely to be met in Dell refurb testing. I used to write NFG in black marker on the ones that passed Dell diags but were defective, just to keep them from being recycled. But then, I knew what I was doing and gave a shit. That was then.

In one sentence, a Dell refurb is not the same thing as a Sony or Panasonic refurb.
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Rocke T Sinetist
as in, 'it doesn't take a...'

[FallenAngel]

Again, key words being reputable companies