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opus
Regular Hater
Joined: 04 Feb 2005
Posts: 15
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 Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 4:55 pm Post subject: Dell Round Rock groups jobs moved to Bangalore |
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About 500 of our jobs got moved to Bangalore. The following groups in Round Rock will be moved into a new Helpdesk structure by mid June:
DCF (Dell Community Forum)
DMC (Dispatch Management Center)
Notify
PNP
Dispatchers
OWR (Out of Warranty Repair)
That's alot of people that haven't been on the phones in a long time.
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moT
Dances with Hate
Joined: 31 May 2003
Posts: 514
Location: Nashville
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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Sounds like it wasn't only in Nashville???
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opus
Regular Hater
Joined: 04 Feb 2005
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:41 pm Post subject: Dell Round Rock groups jobs moved to Bangalore |
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This is just specualtion, but...I think they believe 1/3 will quit rather than go to the phones. Then, after they get the Helpdesk rolling and it makes money (maybe 3 quarters), they will open a mirror image of the Helpdesk in India. Then, riff all the USA jobs.
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Grissom
Lord of the Flies
Joined: 14 Apr 2003
Posts: 1553
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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yeah all of our jobs are going over as well.
Its not right to put that many people back on the phones after so long... but untill there paths are "mapped" then I say every one just chill till the assignment comes along. There are several people that I know for a fact that are trying to keep the current PnP and RS structure in place.
I dont know whats going to happen in Austin, however in the long run i see this as a good thing, compaired to the alternatives that were coming.
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paul_dellcc
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Joined: 04 Oct 2004
Posts: 1960
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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I remember when I was a newbie agent and required PnP's help...
A couple of times I got answers that had nothing to do with my question but I guess that happened because they were not paying attention or they just had too many windows to take care of...
What will happen will all the DPS that Panama can't set up 
I mean, many customers had to call back wondering what's up with their replacements, Exgs, etc because something got screwed in between.
Do you think it will be worst now that it's being outsourced
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HateBSC2
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Joined: 19 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 3:21 am Post subject: |
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| paul_dellcc wrote: | | Do you think it will be worst now that it's being outsourced |
As a consumer, I have yet to see ANY outsourced operation that was as good as the pre-outsourced operation. As a field tech I hated dealing with the outsourced Indian techs for the most part. I talked with a few good ones, but most were lacking in real world experience, all were hampered from providing what I needed by added layers of BS and their sort of Indian-sort of American accents could not be understood.
Some of the issues go away in time, others don't. Unfortunately they were forbidden from speaking English with their own accent, which I understand just fine since I grew up with Indian friends who's parents, aunts, uncles and grand parents spoke with a heavy accent.
In my opinion the whole outsourcing craze is like "down sizing" in the past... all about REDUCING US wages. As more and more jobs head to India, China, etc wages there will rise as the wages in the US drop. Once the average wage in the US is on par or less than the wage in India, China, etc then those jobs will come back to the US and a new round of outsourcing will agree. It is all about increasing the corporate bottom line and screwing the employee in the end.
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paul_dellcc
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Joined: 04 Oct 2004
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Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:01 am Post subject: |
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| HateBSC2 wrote: | | Once the average wage in the US is on par or less than the wage in India, China, etc then those jobs will come back to the US and a new round of outsourcing will agree |
It will take a while though...outsourced wages are pretty low.
I used to earn $1.70 per hour before I was promoted.
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HateBSC2
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Joined: 19 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| HateBSC2 wrote: | | Once the average wage in the US is on par or less than the wage in India, China, etc then those jobs will come back to the US and a new round of outsourcing will agree. |
Damn, messed that up. Agree should be begin.
| paul_dellcc wrote: |
It will take a while though...outsourced wages are pretty low. |
It will take a while, but one will rise while the other falls. So you may start at $1.70/hr, but you get a raise to say $2/hr. A US wage goes from say $12/hr to $11.75 (take a wage cut or lose the job). You go to $2.30/hr, US goes to $11.50. This repeats until the wages are the same or fairly close. The jobs come back to the US for a while and get outsourced for less again.
It is much like the price roll backs at Wal-Mart, Wal-Mart says we will pay you $X per item for a year. The next near they say they will pay $X -10% or something and the price for the item goes down. If the supplier doesn't like it Wal-Mart drops them and they lose much more than agreeing to a reduction in price. Wages have been dropping in the US, you take a wage cut or you lose your job. There is always someone who will do your job for less.
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Blaze
Dances with Hate
Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Posts: 787
Location: AO1
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2005 12:00 am Post subject: |
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| HateBSC2 wrote: | | There is always someone who will do your job for less. |
Which is the exact principle that Dell is playing on now in their post-Y2K quest to become an $80,B company. |
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CE3IBT
Regular Hater
Joined: 19 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2005 1:17 am Post subject: |
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| paul_dellcc wrote: | | HateBSC2 wrote: | | Once the average wage in the US is on par or less than the wage in India, China, etc then those jobs will come back to the US and a new round of outsourcing will agree |
It will take a while though...outsourced wages are pretty low.
I used to earn $1.70 per hour before I was promoted. |
Actually with the announcement of a new "economy" warranty, which I am not clear on yet, I can see where not only wages getting closer but it becoming cheaper to do depot repair with the depot itself being outsourced since the cost of shipping plus the cost of outsourced labor will be less then what is being paid to third parties (BancTec, QualXserve, Unisys etc) and the third party work will dry up even more and the wages paid to third party techs will be cut even more then they have been.
As to wages between domestic and outsource look at these numbers. I am assuming Paul that when you stated $1.70 to start you were converting from Argentina Pesos to US dollars. I don't know when you started work but I include when I did just for reference.
$1.70 USD = 4.92 ARS
$25.00 USD = 72.33 ARS (average per hour in mid 2001 when I started with BancTec)
$18.00 = 52.07 ARS (average per hour in late 2003 after change to IBT program and decrease in call numbers)
$8.15 = 23.58 ARS (per hour rate for Florida for new pay scale program starting April 18, 2005)
Now Banctec is also giving a $7.00 "bonus" per completed call but that is misleading. if you do 4 calls (average) in a day then you have an extra $28.00 for the day but when you divide it by the hours worked it only amounts to $3.50 per hour for an 8 hour day and for the 10 days that most techs put in its only $2.80 per hour. So the "hourly" rate could be said to be between $10.95 (31.67 ARS) and $11.65 (33.70 ARS). Keep in mind that since this is a "bonus" that BancTec is not obligated to pay it. Also keep in mind that problem calls take longer and so the "bonus" gets spread over more hours and contributes less to the hourly rate. Also for most areas that Banctec serves that the real hourly rate (not including the "bonus") will be $7.15 per hour (20.69 ARS). This is due to variations in the minimum wage laws of the different states. Most use the federal guidelines of $5.15 per and BancTec is paying $2.00 more to the majority of their techs with a very few long time senior techs getting $3.00 over minimum wage.
If BancTec holds true to form, then in a few months to a year or slightly more I would expect them to either discontinue the "bonus" or cut the amount paid for the bonus. Additionally, it is unknown by the field whether they will actually be getting paid by the hour or whether they will be salaried and the "hourly rate" figure is just being used to determine the weekly salary amount. If it is the latter then a tech would need to work (in Florida) 53 hours before they would be paid any additional wages and at that point they would only need to be paid $6.15 (17.79 ARS) to stay within the law.
Add into the above scenario the fact that gasoline here has increased from approximately $1.40 in 2001 to $2.30 (in Florida) per gallon and the take is less since most of us drive about 200 miles per day. True, with the new pay schedule they are going to pay us a mileage amount per mile but only 77 percent of what the federal government allows for mileage. The government figure is also based on the older lower prices of $1.75 per gallon and so the coming allowance is likely to be around 41 to 43 cents for mileage which then makes BancTec's reimbursement amount to only about 66 percent based on the government allowing 42 cents.
What all this long winded diatribe amounts to is that Hate's statement is becoming true and faster than most realize. Outsourcing has really only been around in force for less then a decade in the technology, CSR, BPO, and helpdesk fields. Manufacturing has been outsourced a bit longer and in many respects domestic American "manufacturing" is not truely manufacturing but is in reality "assembling" components that have an outsourced state of manufacture. As the trend continues the standard of living improves globally except in the U.S. where it is stagnating and declining. It is not that noticeable to many in the global communty and a lot of U.S. citizens have yet to notice it. Many U.S. citizens are and have been maintaining their standard of living through the use of credit and are living beyond their means. This is evidenced by the drastically higher rates of bankruptcy as well as other items. An example of this living on credit can be seen in how we purchase items. It is becoming far more common to see people using a credit card to purchase their groceries and other neccessities of life. A report I read today states that the use of credit cards to purchase fuel is up from 50% a year ago to over 80% today. It is a creeping menace that will swallow you completely when the income is gone. I fear that when it all catches up to us in the U.S. that not only will we have a massive economic callapse in the U.S. that will make the Great Depression look like a drop in the ocean but that it will effect the global community nearly as bad. The debt that is owed by the U.S. the the global community will not be able to be paid off and those the U.S. owes will likely suffer as bad or worse then we will. It is not a pretty picture for the near future if things are not brought under control.
Don't get me wrong, I am all for anyone or any nation improving their standards of living but it can't happen overnight and from what I can see, many in the global community are trying to do it overnight. It will bite them as it will bite us and those that are supporting excessively fast and unbalanced growth. To a large extent this is due to the greed of Corporate entities in the U.S. many of whom base their business offshore in order to further shelter their incomes and increase thier profits.
Ask yourself why is it that something you can buy for a dollar in one of the outsource countries costs 2 to 20+ times as much here in the U.S. since the manufacturing costs are the same. Part of the answer is government subsidies of imported items. Part of it is corporate greed for product sold domestically. A prime example of this is in the drug business. A drug made in America by an American manufacturer costs more in an American drug store then the EXACT same drug from the same manufacturing plant that is shipped to Canada for sale there. We aren't talking a few dollars here but an amount that is great enough so that it would be cheaper for a U.S. citizen to travel to Canada to purchase their medications yet the U.S. Government will do nothing to rectify this unfair and unbalanced situation. This is an example of Corporate ownership of the U.S. Governemnt and of corporate greed.
Okay I guess I have talked enough and about enough different topic areas. The whole point is that the gap between wages here and wages elsewhere is it IS narrowing and doing so more quickly then most folks are aware of. In so doing most folks are also not aware of the consequences of this too rapid shift of economic power and the consequences of what will happen when the wind blows the house of cards down. Good luck to us all wherever you may be.
CE3IBT
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paul_dellcc
Super Hater
Joined: 04 Oct 2004
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Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2005 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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Fuckin' eh 
That was a very good post with a lot of information. ARS was devalued on 2001 due to our dear Ex President Carlos Saul Menem. Who had the brightest idea of making 1 ARS = 1 USD. How did he do it He sold out almost the entire state. Water, Town gas, Electricity, Telephones, Argentine Airlines and more. All the money was spent in less than 10 years, now you can see people starving to death sleeping in the streets...
So, with ARS devalued it is profitable to outsource companies over here. There is a huge amount of unemployed people, so you can pay whatever you want because of two reasons: A) local government does nothing by recieving checks under the table; B) | HateBSC2 wrote: | | There is always someone who will do your job for less |
That shouldn't happen. Governments should apply the law to all comanies including big ones. Because there are laws which regulate this, they are just not being applied 
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Recon0078
conscientious beginner
Joined: 18 Apr 2005
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| Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:32 pm Post subject: This is no rumor: |
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Hey all,
An inside source verfied it for sure today, that this is no rumor.
All the "Home" based support jobs are going to end up in India.
Techs who work in that department will either be moved to "Enterprise" or "Business" support, or let go altogether.
Sucks to work at Dell.
I got to leave more then 2 years ago, so I was lucky, the stink just got worse.
-And I quote:
"I guess you have heard that the forum is going to India along with OWR and Notify and DMC and I think MLS everything is being turned into helpdesk support or sales for helpdesk.
Yeah the whole jobs going to India happened wed last week. They called an all hands meeting and told everyone they were creating opportunities for the people in India so they would have jobs to move to. And said not everyone would have a job so people are freaking out. Some of the dispatchers think they will keep a couple of them but it going away too, basically everything on the third floor is gone except for executive services. " |
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opus
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| Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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Looks like I got about 6 weeks and then, off to become a Helpdesk Salesperson. Yeah right. I will use that time to find another job within Dell or outside of Dell. They told us that the Helpdesk Sales job is an entry level A4-A5. So, being a B1 they will "adjust" my pay grade down. I won't take a pay cut but my ceiling will be lower. For weeks they had been saying, "update your talent direct so we can map you to the correct job." So being in technical support for seven years, they decide to map me to Sales. Well that makes perfect sense!?? I am viewing the next six weeks as a vacation. I and my fellow workers will let our current (soon to be gone) duties go to pot.
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Blaze
Dances with Hate
Joined: 17 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 12:40 am Post subject: |
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| I hear a big "Oh sh*t !" coming ! So all of the B1's on the third floor are going back to A4/A5's ? Would this include the RS's as well ? |
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opus
Regular Hater
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| Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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Blaze,
Well, they said they are not really sure how it will shake out. I guess I will just wait and see.
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